I think as a junior for about 18 months, and then you go up to full graphic designer. I’ve got to say, our department, I was one of the youngest going in I think, when I started there 23, 22. The department was made up really, of more early middle-aged people. But a couple of them took me under their wing, which is one in particular, who was a lovely and very talented typographer, Ray Freeman. He was working on World in Action, and he kind of took me under his wing a bit. I used to help out, help him on World in Action. In a year or so’s time after that, he recommended when he went onto another programme, that I could take the programme over for a while. Which at that time, I thought, wow, this is quite special. It was a very special programme. So yes, World in Action. A lot of weekends disappeared, because it was a Monday night programme at one time. Not live, but it was being recorded right up until the death. I think it went out at 8:30 on a Monday. So you were working right up to 7:30 often on that one, on a Monday. Yes. Yes, World in Action was for about two years, I think. Two-and-a-half years I think, I did World in Action then, which had its moments. But the stories I would find very, very fascinating. I was lucky enough to work with some very talented people. In fact, I can remember working on a couple of programmes. He won’t remember me, but I certainly remember Paul Greengrass. Yes, I worked on a few programmes with Paul. Again, a mix of personalities. But I remember Paul being very professional and knew what he wanted, but very pleasant with it. Yes.
